Engine ran without oil for unknown period of time (short time) - Honda Dealership did not torque drain plug and it fell out while driving.

[AZCWTypeR]

Rod and crank bearings would be most affected by loss of oil pressure. Cam bearings generally less of an issue, unless larger wear particles were injected.
Plenty of cam lobe pics, but we have roller tappet engines needing very little lube on roller surfaces compared to crank/rod plain bearings.
Change oil yourself with Honda 0W-20 and see if idle oil pressure is below 15 psi with hot oil (210F for example).
It's been said in this forum that below 15psi at idle and below 59psi at 3000rpm isn't good.

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[cryptolime]

Rod and crank bearings would be most affected by loss of oil pressure. Cam bearings generally less of an issue, unless larger wear particles were injected.
Plenty of cam lobe pics, but we have roller tappet engines needing very little lube on roller surfaces compared to crank/rod plain bearings.
Change oil yourself with Honda 0W-20 and see if idle oil pressure is below 15 psi with hot oil (210F for example).
It's been said in this forum that below 15psi at idle and below 59psi at 3000rpm isn't good.

service manual says spec is 14.5 PSI minimum at idle. 58 PSI at 3000 rpm.

 

[TurboZed-R]

service manual says spec is 14.5 PSI minimum at idle. 58 PSI at 3000 rpm.

Key word there is minimum. At idle a healthy engine is over 20 and well over 60psi at 3000 rpm

 

[Bandit_TypeR]

Back Story: I took my 2024 FL5 to a Honda Dealership for my first oil change, it had about 5k miles, so I thought it was probably a good idea to get it done sooner than later. Dealership completed oil change and dropped off my car at my job that evening. After getting off of work I drove back home which is about 12 minutes from my house and didn't drive the car the rest of the night.

The next day I had trip planned to go see a couple of college friends. 10 to 15 minutes into my drive I hear a loud pop sound and first thing that comes to mind is that maybe my exhaust pipe fell off or something. When I looked up at my rear view mirror I see a cloud of white smoke and instantly get worried and immediately turn around to go back home since I was right around the corner. I was relieved when the white smoke left, but then my fear came back when I heard loud vibrations. I could hear and feel the vibrations anytime I stepped on the gas pedal. A minute from my house my dash lights start flashing stating oil pressure low and to contact dealership. At this point I'm panicking and decide to turn off the car and put car in neutral and push the car the rest of the way down to my house. When I got to my house I looked underneath the car and there was a bunch of oil spewing out of the oil pan. I go and check the engine dipstick and the engine is dry. When going up to the house I notice oil drops all over my driveway and puddle of oil in the garage which I didn't notice when I pulled out of the garage (I wish I would have cause I could have probably prevented a lot of damage).

So I immediately call Dealership and tell them what happened. They agreed to have car towed to shop and provided me with a loaner. They ended up confirming that the technician didn't properly screw oil drain plug and with the vibrations the oil drain plug fell out which caused the oil to drain completely. I explain to them my fear that the car had suffered internal damage due to the heat and the fact that the car ran without oil for some unknown time, albeit probably a short time. They told me they replaced engine oil and that no DTC errors came up. I told them that I wanted more reassurance and wanted them to check cam bearing and pistons and cylinder walls to make sure nothing was warped or scored. I honestly didn't even want to go this route, because I was afraid that I would be messing with the integrity of the engine because I had to trust that the guys would be meticulous and precise this time around and make sure every nut and bolt was torqued to factory spec. In the end I was actually required to do this before they would give any resolution to my options.

I provided them with the following options.

1.) My car is practically brand new and only had 5k miles and the fact that it ran without oil, even for a minute or two, in my opinion ruined the integrity of the engine and most likely caused premature wear and tear decreasing the life span of the vehicle. So I asked them if they could buy back the car and pay me what it would cost for me to buy a similar FL5 on the used market with similar miles. That was a hard no for them. They stated they could only give me wholesale price and wouldn't be able to offer me what I wanted for it.

2.) I then offered to trade in car but still wanted them to give me a trade in value that would be similar to what the market rate is for the a 2024 FL5 with 5k miles. That was also a no. They stated they are willing to fix their mistake. Which they are working on, but it's been hard for me to convince them that my peace of mind can't be bought anymore and the fact that they can't 100% say with certainty that there is no damage does not make me feel any better.

3.) Lastly, I asked for extended warranty to provide me protection past the manufacturer warranty just in case something does go wrong. They agreed to give me a 100k 6year extended warranty. They assure me that with the warranty I don't have to worry about engine not being covered as long as I stay up to date with maintenance. My fear is that in the future if something does happen I may not be covered, because of something in the fine print that I didn't read.



I have documented proof of them admitting to mistake and them requiring me to open up my engine. I also have photos of engine and proof that once again their quality control measures are subpar as there was red lint all over critical areas of engine from their red shop rags. I feel that if they believe the car is all good then they should have no problem buying car from me even if it means losing or not making money on my car to make this right.

What would you guys do in this situation? Would you just take warranty? And take the gamble that nothing happens in the future? Even though I shouldn’t have to take any gamble given the fact that I basically brought in a brand new car to them and now it’s ruined in my head in terms of peace of mind?

I'd be concerned what's in the service database system on this matter. If you go to trade in later, you might get dinged. I have such bad OCD I would be making them take a trade-in especially if they think there's nothing to worry about. They should take the car back and treat you very fairly on a 2025. Not sure how Honda corporate would respond because it's a dealership issue. Tough situation.

This post made my stomach turnover. Sorry for your situation.

 

[TchnoZ33]

Any headway on this?

 

[Pekingduck]

Damn this suck after reading this thread but it happens. It happened to my friend at the track he change his oil but never used a torque wrench and spilled oil all over the track. He ended up replacing the motor. After that I torque down everything within reason. I can understand the dealership and the damage is done. I would probably take warranty with something in writing about aftermarket parts will not be denied from warranty claims and maybe try to get them to throw carbon wing and I would call myself whole. I hope you get it resolved to your satisfaction.

 

[kster]

I'd be concerned what's in the service database system on this matter. If you go to trade in later, you might get dinged. I have such bad OCD I would be making them take a trade-in especially if they think there's nothing to worry about. They should take the car back and treat you very fairly on a 2025. Not sure how Honda corporate would respond because it's a dealership issue. Tough situation.

Second this. If this incident shows up in service records and/or Carfax, there will be loss of value. I'd request a trade-in or replacement engine.

 

[WillyK]

I had this happen to my Celica GTS back in 2001. I left the dealership after an oil change and heard a loud sound under the car, like I ran over a big rock. I soon came to a stop light and started to wonder if it was the drain plug. Sure enough, as I pull away from the light very slowly I can see a puddle of oil. I pulled into a gas station just through the intersection, turned the car off and called the dealer. They sent a tow truck out and took the car back and had it for 2 days going over the engine and assured me everything was good to go.

Everything was good to go, I finally sold the car in 2016 and it had about 138000 miles on it. Never burned a drop of oil and ran great the entire time I had it.

 

[SIFL5]

Update:
The dealership has agreed to buy the car back, with the condition that I trade it in for something from their lot. I ended up getting a CRV for just under MSRP. In the end, I lost a little over $2k—more if you factor in the $2.5k I spent on parts and accessories. So, I won’t pretend I'm happy with how things turned out, because I’m not. As much as I wanted to keep the car, I knew I could never have the peace of mind I deserved with my FL5. I wish I was one of those guys that could just be ok with it and not worry about it, but unfortunately I'm not.

That being said, I don't place blame on anyone, as I know mistakes can happen. I found plenty of these horror stories online with different outcomes. What's more important is how those mistakes are handled. In my case, I felt like I had to argue my point—explaining why I believed the car had suffered premature engine damage, despite their findings when they opened the valve cover gasket. If I had been offered a warranty from the start, I probably would have had more trust in the dealership and felt more confident in keeping the car. Unfortunately, that wasn't the case. I had to request a warranty myself, and because I had to ask, I wanted assurances in writing that they wouldn't deny my claim if something happened to the engine (even if I used aftermarket parts). They couldn’t provide that, so I decided to trade the car in.

I’ve reached out to a few dealerships offering FL5s at MSRP, so I’m hopeful I can work out a deal without taking too much of a financial hit. If that doesn’t work out, I’ll sell the remaining parts and accessories to help recoup some of my losses. The only thing that brings solace to me is knowing that eventually I'll be back in a FL5, just have to be patient and find the right deal.

 

[Zpeedster M]

Unfortunately poor service / accidents happen at the dealership service. One guy had his rim curbed at the service center but they denied any responsibility and was very hostile to the Type S owner. He's a youtuber and made several videos on it. Long story short Honda reached out and the dealer to make it right because of the social media backlash. His channel is Que the Chaotic. It's unfortunate to have to go through such measures to correct a problem the service center created.

 

[Starchland]

That’s tough how it played out. Best of luck to you under that tough circumstance. Now the question is, does the dealer disclose the situation to the prospective buyer :/

 

[cryptolime]

That’s tough how it played out. Best of luck to you under that tough circumstance. Now the question is, does the dealer disclose the situation to the prospective buyer :/

hell no they won't

 

[jtlctr]

Update:
The dealership has agreed to buy the car back, with the condition that I trade it in for something from their lot. I ended up getting a CRV for just under MSRP. In the end, I lost a little over $2k—more if you factor in the $2.5k I spent on parts and accessories. So, I won’t pretend I'm happy with how things turned out, because I’m not. As much as I wanted to keep the car, I knew I could never have the peace of mind I deserved with my FL5. I wish I was one of those guys that could just be ok with it and not worry about it, but unfortunately I'm not.

That being said, I don't place blame on anyone, as I know mistakes can happen. I found plenty of these horror stories online with different outcomes. What's more important is how those mistakes are handled. In my case, I felt like I had to argue my point—explaining why I believed the car had suffered premature engine damage, despite their findings when they opened the valve cover gasket. If I had been offered a warranty from the start, I probably would have had more trust in the dealership and felt more confident in keeping the car. Unfortunately, that wasn't the case. I had to request a warranty myself, and because I had to ask, I wanted assurances in writing that they wouldn't deny my claim if something happened to the engine (even if I used aftermarket parts). They couldn’t provide that, so I decided to trade the car in.

I’ve reached out to a few dealerships offering FL5s at MSRP, so I’m hopeful I can work out a deal without taking too much of a financial hit. If that doesn’t work out, I’ll sell the remaining parts and accessories to help recoup some of my losses. The only thing that brings solace to me is knowing that eventually I'll be back in a FL5, just have to be patient and find the right deal.

I’m really sorry to hear that it worked out the way it did for you. Good customer service is not easily found these days in the automotive industry. I think you made the right move trading it in and not having nightmares of scored bearings for years to come! You will find another one. Maybe you can find a slightly used example and break even financially.
I also want to say that I commend you for having a great attitude in such a disappointing scenario. What you said about not blaming anyone speaks of your good nature. The world would benefit greatly by more of this kind of thinking. As they say in Australia, "Good on ya, Mate".

Best of luck finding your next FL5!

 

[jpindustrie]

Just curious if you opened a case with corporate. They don’t always ‘just side with the dealer’ , especially if you’re within lemon law protection etc , I’ve seen people involve corporate and open cases for missing parts for routine service and then get satisfaction. It’s not only for ‘big things’ if this happened to me I would have called corporate/opened a case first thing

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